At the end of this week, Timothy ‘Tim’ Jones leaves the Seymour Centre at the University of Sydney, where he has served as Artistic Director and General Manager since January 2009.
His 16-year tenure at the multi-venue Seymour Centre has ensured the institution is an essential part of Sydney’s cultural landscape. One example of his transformative work was the creation of an annual arts education program, which engages over 35,000 school students annually, and has forged key partnerships with the University of Sydney’s faculties and schools through productions such as Made to Measure by Alana Valentine (Charles Perkins Centre) and Transparency by Suzie Miller (Sydney Law School).
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Jones has also led numerous major venue refurbishment projects, programmed 15 seasons of work from the independent theatre sector (including a number of award-winning productions, including major wins in the 2024 Sydney Theatre Awards for Trophy Boys and The Inheritance) and developed ongoing partnerships with key cultural organisations including City of Sydney, Mardi Gras and Sydney Festival. In 2022, Jones directed the world premiere adaptation of The Museum of Modern Love for Seymour and Sydney Festival.
Supporting emerging and independent companies has also been a feature of Jones’ term with the likes of SIMA Jazz, Shaun Parker and Company (whose production KING was invited to Belgrade earlier this year), Squabbalogic and Sport for Jove all, at various times, in residence at Seymour.
All this and more, including a glowing testament paid to Jones by the University of Sydney’s Director of Museums and Cultural Engagement, Michael Dagostino, can be read in ArtsHub’s announcement of Jones’ impending departure in our weekly On the move column from 18 February this year.
Here, Jones reflects on his time at the Seymour, in a wide-ranging and detailed interview with ArtsHub, which has been edited for clarity and brevity.
Looking back on your 16 years at the Seymour Centre, what have you learned about arts management from that time that you would like to share with the rest of the sector?
My first thought is to say that this particular role is incredibly large and has probably, in my time, become too large for one person… A three- to four-venue arts centre operating year round is a huge thing and, essentially, Seymour Centre operates with a very lean staff, so we all multitask. And what that means is that – in the past – I have been able to work quickly to raise the artistic profile, which was what I was [hired] to do, while at the same time managing, leading and trying to make improvements to the venue and its infrastructure itself, as and when I could.
I think, quite rightly, the rise of our work health and safety guidelines, the rise of compliance, the rise of consultation in the administrative process across every level, is absolutely right. It didn’t exist 10 to 15 years ago… But I would say that now, the administrative requirements are large enough that they make the dual role pretty hard to achieve in terms of making the best advantage of the potential that an Artistic Director of the Seymour Centre could achieve.
Read: What I’ve learned creating a Cultural Safety Document
So in terms of the sector, I would say the message is the need for adequate resourcing in order to deliver the arts properly, responsibly, safely and with suitable aspirations for artistic excellence and innovation. It’s very difficult to do both. So, to come back to your question, I have discovered that in the early days it was possible to combine the roles with the small support staff that we have here, and now it’s getting more and more increasingly challenging.
The Seymour Centre doesn’t have a Board, to which you could make recommendations about potentially splitting the AD/GM role into two positions. Do you see whoever replaces you perhaps changing the role in the future?
Because we’re part of the University of Sydney, we’re part of the Cultural Engagement portfolio, which is headed by Michael Dagostino, then through him to Kirsten Andrews, who is the Vice-President of External Engagement. And so, essentially, because we’re part of the University, we do not have a Board structure. And so, in a sense, it has been a great benefit to not have had a Board, because the administrative oversight required for managing a Board is such that probably it would make this role that I’ve got really incredibly hard – monthly Board papers etc.
So, in the future, maybe that might change. But, no, the operating model has been very much a direct reporting line to those people at the University, with support from, at times, the University Development Office in terms of fundraising and the vast University network of support that we get as being part of the University. So I’m talking about HR, I’m talking about IT and so on.
I imagine, when the new person [who replaces me] comes on board, they will develop a new strategic plan and how those goals in their strategic plan are to be achieved. One of those could be a different sort of governance structure, for example.
And what have you learned about working with artists in that time?
What I’ve learned about artists is that there is no shortage of individuals in this country with extraordinary skill, artistic skill, wishing to find a platform, to find the right place to showcase and express their artistic ambitions, the stories they want to tell, the stories they want to explore. There is absolutely no shortage of really skilled people.
The challenge is providing those artists, companies etc, with the right organisational framework to allow them to bring their ideas to fruition. That’s the challenge. We have great playwrights, great theatre-makers, great sound designers, great lighting designers – some of whom I’ve worked with in my time here – and the consistent refrain is, ‘If we had more time, if we had more development dollars, if we could have been developing this for six months, six years, then we really would have cracked something more than what we’ve been able to do at this moment, in the rush to the finish line’.
What major changes have you seen in the Australian cultural landscape over those 16 years?
So if we’re talking about the sector in general, it’s a really interesting question, because I think we’ve gone broadly, within that time, from a state of artistic health and abundance to our current state, where things are incredibly lean.
I’m thinking of those early Sydney Festivals that were led by Lindy Hume and then Fergus Linehan. Under Fergus, we had the Festival First Nights, which took over the city – these incredibly large-scale performances where the city itself was activated and vibrant. It seemed to be brimming with the optimism of how the arts can impact and have meaning in our lives. And everyone [in the sector] seemed to be engaged in that sort of thinking about the scene.
I’m thinking of very early days when we had The Manganiyar Seduction under Lindy Hume’s direction of Sydney Festival, which saw our big York Theatre taken over by at least 40 musicians from Rajasthan. And they could have just kept on playing; it was packed out every night.
Read: After 20 years, Lindy Hume has programmed her final festival
At this point of the interview, Jones references Sydney Biennale’s takeover of Cockatoo Island (a former prison and shipyard) in its 2008 edition and for several editions thereafter, specifically highlighting the buzz on the ferry across to the island; he also discusses major works by Sydney Theatre Company (STC) from the period, specifically the final outing by the STC Actors Company, The War of the Roses (2009), which condensed eight of Shakespeare’s 10 History Plays into four acts over four hours, and which the prestigious $15,000 Pascall Prize-winning critic Alison Croggon called “a work of massive intellectual and theatrical ambition“ on her important and archived blog, Theatre Notes.
Those events were monumental artistic achievements that we probably felt at the time were special, but at the same time achievable. And now they seem like, ‘Wow. Can you imagine Sydney Theatre Company having a company of actors that were on contract for the whole year doing amazing work like that?’ I’m not sure when that will ever happen again.
It feels, looking back at those times, that back then things were better, and now things are tougher. Currently, I think we’re in a situation where funding for the arts is incredibly lean, and there were all sorts of measures and boosts during COVID, and now I think we’re in a time where we are experiencing the impacts of that necessary spend during COVID, and that is combined with the legacy of COVID on audiences – and with that has [come] the cost of living crisis, which means that the audience dollar is much more carefully watched at a household level and what they’re going to spend on is much more scrutinised too.
Whare are your proudest achievements from your 16 years at the Seymour Centre?
There are [several] areas that are my proudest achievements. The first is the support for independent companies that we’ve been able to provide and help them to exist and achieve longevity. I’m thinking about … Squabbalogic, who I think recently brought their operation to a close [after 18 years], but were with us for eight to 10 years doing a show each year. I’m thinking of Sugary Rum Productions, who recently produced The Inheritance, to great acclaim here at Seymour Centre.
And really, that whole program [of independent works], which began as the Reg Season [in the Seymour’s studio space, the 148-seater Reginald Theatre], and it’s become a Seymour season, really working with independent and small companies to produce their best work. But interestingly, and that is by fortunate design, it has actually always been – pre-me – part of the Seymour Centre’s operational practice, by fortune or design. Interesting independent companies have always been showcased here.
The other side that I’m particularly proud of are the major works that we’ve been able to produce and present in our bigger theatres, that link the intellectual capital of the University with artistic practice, which has been another thing I’ve been keen to try and do.
Jones references collaborations between a Taiwanese dance artist working with robotics and a robot loaned from a car manufacturer, which was part of a robotics conference at the School of Architecture, and works tackling climate change and the fight again cancer, each co-presented with a range of external partners, and many more, including…
Transparency, which is going back many years, but this was a partnership with the Law School here at the University, and it was one of Suzie Miller’s early works. And that was the Australian premiere of a work that was really tough. It was about dealing with adults who’ve committed terrible crimes as children, and how they survive when they’re released from prison and then try to go on and have an adult life.
So those ones I’m particularly proud of – and probably the top of the tree is Museum of Modern Love, which was part of the 2022 Sydney Festival. It was developed under the most difficult circumstances during COVID. It was a project that we pushed through; it really gave the staff here a focal point when we were shut down, and we were developing it online, working with the cast and creative team. It was an adaptation of Heather Rose’s Stella Prize-winning novel, adapted by Tom Holloway, and it went through so many times when it would have probably been easier to shut it down entirely.
It was all about interaction with people up close and personal, and inspired by the [Marina] Abramović residency at the Museum of Modern Art, where people just sit across from each other. And you can imagine that, during COVID, we had actors in masks, and that wasn’t going to work – but the fact that we were able to get that up and deliver that was a real achievement as well.
Jones also mentions the Seymour Centre’s arts education program, mentioned at the top of this article, which now features…
35,000-plus high school and primary school students who are walking through the door to engage in performing arts experiences that add to their study. And so I’m really proud that that continues and achieves what it has, and that students are coming en masse to experience the best the performing arts can offer, and engage with it, see it and talk about it, and that is hopefully an audience generation program for the future.
Any major regrets from your time at the Seymour Centre? Things you aspired to do, but weren’t able to achieve, for example?
I regret that I’ve not found the right funding mechanism to enable us to employ more staff, in line with other venues of similar scale and seating capacity. There is enormous capacity for Seymour to do more than we currently do, but we need a few more boots on the ground to take full advantage of the venue’s real potential.
I’ve directed six new theatre works in my time here, but also regret that I was not able to do more. Over the years, artists pitched so many great ideas to me, it would have been great to be in the position to invest in more projects and produce them from scratch at Seymour.
Any final remarks you’d care to share?
I would say, as a kind of finishing note – and I’ve banged on about this to whoever will listen for years, and I believe it and I’ll keep saying it – I believe the Seymour Centre is, has and can continue to move forward and reach its full potential. Or another way of saying that is that I believe it can keep its legacy – it’s 50 years old this year – and it has enormous assets in order to really keep moving forward and contribute meaningfully to the performing arts landscape in this city.
There was a lot of comment [when I first started here] that the Seymour Centre was in a bad part of town. That it was hard to get to. There were comments like, ‘it was old and tired’. And now those views seem to be … not so commonly held.
The Seymour Centre is now in a really good, physical place. The building itself, while it is brutalist, is also incredibly solid. And the theatre sizes themselves are really useful for this sort of mid-scale work. I really believe that.
And then, of course, the cultural capital of being part of the University is an extraordinary asset as well for a particular style and stream of work that takes advantage of what being part of a University is – which is questioning, risking, looking at what’s next, exploring technology and where the future of the performing arts may be going and how that can intersect with our arts education programs.
I think the future potential can be huge. It’s tough and it will be a challenge to realise that, but I think that the core foundations are really strong. And so I really hope that the new person – or people – can really take Seymour forward into its next iteration, because I believe it can achieve great things, and also, really contribute meaningfully to our arts culture and community, and contribute meaningfully to the growth and development of the arts in Australia, artists and companies.
Timothy Jones’ final day as Artistic Director and General Manager of the Seymour Centre at the University of Sydney is this Friday 2 May.
