The latest free webinar in the Creative Exchange program, co-produced by ArtsHub and Creative Victoria, was held on 30 November 2023 and is now available to access online. In this webinar, our trio of panellists shared their expertise to assist you in picking the right platforms, amassing followers and getting cut-through in an increasingly cluttered and ever-changing social media landscape.
Even though it may feel as if social media has been around for ever, there are still many creatives and workers in the creative sector who struggle to use it effectively. Indeed, today it’s often a case of too much – as we can feel overwhelmed and under-resourced when launching into the space.
Do we use paid or organic? Which will get the most cut-through for our art or organisation? And, most importantly, which is the best platform to use? Should you be “all and everywhere” or focus your time, resources and efforts on the platform best suited to your message? Is SnapChat just for teens and how can a well-established organisation or practitioner make the most of TikTok? Where do Instagram and LinkedIn come into this and is Facebook really just for grandparents today?
What about the legacy brands like Tumblr and Pinterest? Do they still have the same clout? And is it possible to use Twitter, sorry X, to help spread the word about your practice or organisation?
Many of these questions were addressed by our panel of experts: multi award-winning visual artist Atong Atem, Marketing and Events Manager at Little Rocket Kelsey Dubar, and Head of Brand and Content at RISING Anna Horan. The panel was moderated by Melbourne Arts Precinct Corporation (MAP Co)’s Social Media and Content Producer, Kate Mulqueen.
What they weren’t able to explore, however, was cancel culture or some of the darker sides of using social media. That huge topic is one for another day. It was also impossible during the time allotted to get to all attendees’ questions, so we’ve compiled a list of resources that may be of assistance:
Troubleshooting/safety
Social media safety advice – RAINN (Rape, Abuse and Incest National Network)
Three social media scams every artist needs to know
How to find your sweet spot with social media
Social media scams
Safety guide for artists – Artists at Risk Connection
Information and Practical advice
Social media information sheet for artists (Arts Law)
Mastering social media for visual artists: a focused guide (Arts Artists Network)
The impact of using social media as an artist (We Are Unlimited UK)
Social media marketing courses
Social media holidays to note
The beginner’s guide to LinkedIn marketing and networking
Loomly content hub
How to find, use and create Instagram Reel templates
The easiest way to upload YouTube shorts
How to remove TikTok watermarks
How to use LinkedIn effectively
The presenters
Atong Atem
Atong Atem is an Ethiopian born, South Sudanese artist and writer living in Narrm/Melbourne. Her work explores the inherent intimacy of portraiture and photography, as well as the role photographers take as storytellers. Atem interrogates photography as a framework for looking at the world and positioning people in it.
Atem references the works of photographers Malick Sidibe, Philip Kwame Apagya and Seydou Keita to create a visual representation of a relationship to culture. She works primarily with photography and video to explore migrant narratives and postcolonial practices in the African diaspora, the relationship between public and private spaces and the exploration of home and identity through portraiture.
Atem has exhibited her work across Australia, including National Gallery of Victoria, Art Gallery of New South Wales, National Portrait Gallery, Immigration Museum, Gertrude Contemporary, Australian Centre for Contemporary Art and Internationally at Tate Modern, Photo London 2023, Photo Basel 2022, Red Hook Labs in New York and Vogue Fashion Fair in Milan. Atem was the recipient of the inaugural La Prairie Art Award from the Art Gallery of New South Wales, the 15 Artists 2022 prize from Moreton Bay Council in 2022, National Gallery of Victoria and MECCA M-Power scholarship in 2017 as well as the Brisbane Powerhouse Melt Portrait Prize in 2016.
Kelsey Dubar
Kelsey Dubar is the Marketing and Events Manager at Little Rocket, a 100% owned and operated First Nations Creative and Marketing agency based in Collingwood, Narrm/Melbourne.
Kelsey has been working in the marketing world for up to seven years now, after graduating from Monash University with a Bachelor of Business, majoring in both Marketing & Accounting. With both a creative and strategic mind she started her career in small creative startups, moving into freelance, allowing her to evolve her skills with a variety of clients. Building on her career, she shifted into the event industry, loving the organised chaos they bring. This created a pathway to combining her interests in both marketing and events.
Anna Horan
Anna Horan is the Head of Brand and Content at RISING. Anna has worked across multiple industries producing and overseeing content, from city guides in youth media, to branded editorial for advertising clients, to government communications at the TAC.
In 2020, she moved into arts marketing, joining the RISING team, where she helped launch the brand into market (without a festival). Anna now oversees all of RISING’s content channels and creative, as well as merchandise and festival documentation.
Moderator – Kate Mulqueen
Kate Mulqueen is a marketing professional, actor, writer and critic, based in Naarm/Melbourne. She has previously worked as a Marketing Manager in the Higher Education sector, as Head of Marketing at Circus Oz, and now manages social media and content for Fed Square, now part of the Melbourne Arts Precinct Corporation. Kate also freelances as a social media adviser in the performing arts and is a regular performing arts reviewer for ArtsHub.
You can access the video from ArtsHub‘s YouTube channel or watch it below.
Transcript
Claire Febey
1:37
Hi everyone, on behalf of Creative Victoria and ArtsHub, welcome to today’s Creative Exchange webinar: Using Social Media to Promote your Creative Business. While we’re all joining from different locations today, I want to start by acknowledging the traditional owners of the land on which we each live and work. I’m on Dja Dja Wurrung Country today in beautiful but very cold and stormy central Victoria and I want to pay my respects to Dja Dja Elders past and present, and also acknowledge any First Nations people who are on the call with us today.
This webinar is taking place on Aboriginal land, and sovereignty has never been ceded. My name is Claire Febey, I’m the CEO of Creative Victoria, my preferred pronouns are she and he. I’m a cis white woman, short brown hair wearing black glasses today. And also for Aus Music T Shirt Day, I’m wearing a Cash Savage and The Last Drinks t-shirt, and my thanks to Cash and the band for giving me what remains my most extraordinary post-COVID music moment to this day. A bit of housekeeping before we get started, this webinar is being live captioned. If you’d like to access the captioning, just select Show Captions from the Zoom menu. Or if that doesn’t work, then you can click the link in the chat.
We’re also recording this session today. So any questions that you ask will be part of the recording. The recorded webinar will be available through the Creative Exchange page on the Creative Victoria website and also on ArtsHub. We’ll send out a survey following the webinar. So please do fill that in and let us know how we’ve gone and what you’d like to hear from us in the future. Hashtags for today’s event, #CreativeVic and #CreativeXchange. As always, we’re very happy to be working in partnership with ArtsHub to bring you this Creative Exchange webinar. And social media is such a hot button topic. We all think we should be on socials, some people are making a living out of working with social media. But what does it really look like to use social media as a tool to promote and grow your creative business? How do you find your audience? How do you get them to stick with you? And how do you make money with it? Today, our expert panel will share their insights into the complex and ever-changing social media landscape. But before I do a quick introduction of the panel, I need to let you know that there has been a late change of panel members.
Unfortunately, John Burgess from Little Rocket is no longer able to be with us today as he’s got some sorry business and our thoughts go out to John. However, we’re very pleased to have his colleague Kelsey Dubar, Marketing and Events Manager at Little Rocket, who’s going to share her social media experience in today’s webinar. Kelsey will be joined by Atong Atem, an Ethiopian born South Sudanese artist and writer living in Naarm. Atong works with portraiture photography and storytelling. And then our panel is rounded out by Anna Horan, Head of Brand and Content at Rising Festival. Anna oversees all of Rising’s content channels and creative, as well as merchandise and festival documentation. And, of course, today’s webinar will be moderated by Kate Mulqueen who freelances as a social media adviser in the performing arts and is a regular performing arts reviewer for ArtsHub. Kate also managers social media and content for Fed Square, which is now part of the Melbourne Arts Precinct Corporation. While I’m here I’ve been asked to give a quick plug to the new Creative Exchange podcast series.
The podcast delves deeper into some of the themes that are explored n our webinars. And the first couple of episodes are available now. ‘Catching Curveballs’, looking at how creative organisations and individuals have innovated in the face of crisis or change, and the first in a two-parter, which is about the value of mentorships. So please do check them out. But now it’s my pleasure to hand over to Kate Mulqueen to kick-start today’s discussion. Thanks so much, Kate, and over to you.
Kate Mulqueen
5:41
Hello, hi, everyone. As Claire has said, my name is Kate Mulqueen. And I’ll be moderating today’s session. I’m really pleased to be able to be coming in from Wurundjeri Woiwurrung country here in beautiful Naarm. And I have our fantastic panellists here Atong, Kelsey and Anna to share their insights. Social media is, as Claire said, a huge area that everyone’s interested in. And I’m really interested to hear what everyone has to say. So, as Claire mentioned, as well, I do some freelancing in this space. And it’s my job, but I feel like I’m constantly learning and always have something to learn from other people, as I’m sure you’ll find today, as well.
So what I might do is hand over to each of our panellists to introduce themselves, and just say something in a short, two-minute spiel about who they are, what they do, and perhaps something about their personal views on social media. I might hand over to you Atong, first.
Atong Atem
6:49
Thank you, Claire (Kate). Hi. My name is Atong Atem. I’m also on Wurundjeri Woiwurrung country in Naarm. I grew up on Kuringgai country, Central Coast of New South Wales, but have been here for like 10 years, I think, doing my practice as a visual artist. My work is mostly photography-based, a lot of studio photography, film, that sort of thing. And a lot of my visual art practices sort of emerged from my own identity as a South Sudanese woman living in Australia as a migrant. And as a person who’s interested in history. So it’s been really interesting to be able to share that on social media and have access to a diaspora community. And I’m excited to delve into that as we chat today.
Kate Mulqueen
7:38
Thanks Atong. And I might pass over to you, Anna, if you could introduce yourself as well.
Anna Horan
7:45
Sure thing. Hi, everyone. My name is Anna Horan. So yeah, as mentioned, I’m the Head of Brand and Content at Rising. I’d also like to acknowledge the traditional owners of the lands that are gathered on. Yeah, I’m currently on Wurundjeri Woiwurrung country. But yeah, grew up on Wadawurrung Country down in Geelong. Yeah, I suppose my role has really expanded in the time that I’ve been at Rising. At first, it was launching the brand into market when we didn’t have a festival.
So a lot of that was done through content and social media and building up that audience online, before we could actually have a physical presence. And yeah, so I kind of have some strong views about how content can play a role in building your brand and connecting with audiences. But really, it should come down to, yeah, who your audience is. And yeah, I suppose what the message you’re trying to communicate and get across should be. Yeah.
Kate Mulqueen
8:55
Kelsey, you’re just on mute if you just want to take yourself off mute.
KD
Kelsey Dubar
9:01
My name is Kelsey. I would also like to acknowledge the lands on which I’m joining from today the Wurundjeri Woiwurrung, here in Naarm. As mentioned, I am the Marketing and Events manager at Little Rocket filling in for my director John Burgess. Little Rocket is a First Nations full service creative and marketing agency. We’re based in Brunswick, we cover design, audiovisual, event management, marketing and communications, art management, talent management, merchandising, animation, PR. Yeah, there’s a lot of talents in our team that’s pretty endless.
I graduated from university with a Bachelor business degree majoring in both marketing and accounting, which I was lucky enough to kind of land an internship straight into kind of a social media role, where I advanced my career in marketing. Unfortunately, accounting is still not made by resumes. So that’s still just parked on the side. Yeah, and I really enjoy my work/life balance. I aligned myself as well with the sports brand 2XU, I’ve been an ambassador for them for about three years. Yeah.
Kate Mulqueen
10:10
Thanks, Kelsey, that’s great. I might just get started. We’ve got a lot to cover. So I wanted to talk about how each of you potentially got started, I might start with Atong, because, as an artist, you know, maybe tell your story about how you first got into social media and why you chose the channels that you chose to be on.
Atong Atem
10:35
It’s a great sort of point to start with, because I think my start with social media actually coincided with my start, in terms of being like, an emerging, or practising artists, and delving into potentially becoming a full-time artist, which is what I do now. So I will say that my start was maybe easier than others, because I think I grew up quite immersed in internet culture, and had a strong relationship with using the internet for more than just say, research in school or whatever, and being at, you know, being part of communities that exist primarily, if not exclusively, online. So it was really natural for me to then extend that into into the work that I was doing.
Before this panel, I was actually thinking about how best to describe my relationship to social media as a visual artist and how I use it and what kind of tool it is for me. And I will say that I think primarily at the beginning anyway, it started off as like an extension of a visual diary. You know, it wasn’t specifically initially to market anything or to showcase or, you know, sell or promote. It was specifically to just have a place in which my art could exist when it wasn’t, you know, in a gallery like once or twice every three years, if I was lucky back then. And I think that really nurtured my relationship to it and allowed it to be an extension of my work, rather than this really difficult, complicated thing that I was trying to wrestle with.
Yeah, and I think so many communities exist online that it made it really easy for me as an artist to feel like there was a space that kind of existed to use social media as a tool, to not be drowned underneath the complexities and difficulties of it. And to adapt to it, and to also, in some ways, adapt my work, to maybe internet ways of showing without necessarily compromising. So, yeah, I think social media, for me has been an extension of my practice, rather than something that I’ve had to navigate per se.
Kate Mulqueen
12:41
And are there platforms that you specifically jumped on, because they suit what you do, or how is that choice made?
Atong Atem
12:48
Yes, the platforms – I think, to begin with, I will say that I probably started showing my work when I first started studying art, which was I think, 2011, or 12, is when I was at art school. So I don’t, I don’t think Instagram was a big thing there. I don’t actually remember when Instagram started. So that was not a platform that I initially used. I initially was using things like Tumblr, and creating these sort of free online blogs and sharing kind of inspiration as well as my own work. But because I’m a visual artist. And because I primarily work with photography, Instagram was an incredibly easy and welcomed platform, because it’s designed to showcase images and specifically photos.
And it also meant that I had that comfortability of showing works in progress and not feeling like it needed to be like a gallery of completed works. So I’ve gravitated towards Instagram. And to some extent, I used Twitter as well. But that was more so to sort of talk ideas and to have dialogue, I suppose about kind of larger things that exist in the art world. But yeah, I haven’t really delved further than what suits visual art, and what fits with the kind of visual art that I make, which is predominantly portraiture. So there’s sort of, I think the algorithms changed to kind of prefer video maybe now, but Instagram loves faces, and I make a lot of faces with my work. So it suited me really well.
Kate Mulqueen
14:26
I might throw to Anna, you touched on it in your introduction about audiences and how was that considered when Rising began when you were deciding where to be, what platforms to engage with and how to approach your strategy on social media?
Anna Horan
14:43
Sure, so I guess when we first launched Rising, we did have kind of a legacy audience from Melbourne Festival days, but that was primarily on our email list and that kind of thing. So we had to really build our other channels up from scratch in many instances. And, yeah, I suppose take into consideration that there would be probably some significant attrition with the change, I suppose in approach and what we were trying to do as a festival. And I guess you’re really thinking about what audiences exist in different spaces. So on Instagram, obviously, it’s a much more visual place.
There are a lot of artists and yeah, I suppose curious audiences looking to explore and find inspiration on that platform. Whereas at the time, something like Twitter or now Threads is kind of where conversations are happening. Less kind of, I suppose, content sharing, in that sense, more conversations. And then I suppose something like LinkedIn is really about, you know, people are on there to kind of build their professional resumes and to connect with other people in the sector. So that’s where we really focus, I suppose, our communications around who we are as a festival, in terms of the arts sector, our place in the arts ecology, and also as a place to work as well. And obviously, to advertise things like jobs and that kind of thing. And there is crossover between the different platforms, but I think, yeah, thinking about ‘who is actually on those platforms, and what are they looking for?’ sort of drives the content that lives there.
Anna Horan
16:38
Did you do any kind of benchmarking when you were starting about what kinds of accounts that you’re looking at to, perhaps perhaps draw from or, you know, that you looked to, to that we’re kind of doing great stuff?
AH
Anna Horan
16:56
Um, yeah, I think at the time, yeah, for some channels, we could kind of compare ourselves to the previous festival, I suppose it’s a little different, at least when we’re starting out, because we do operate on a yearly cycle. So obviously have peaks and troughs of when we’re pushing out a lot of content. And it’s really actually, only after three years of having, kind of, I mean, only technically had two festivals, not three, but, you know, kind of three, four campaigns, and trying out a whole bunch of different content at those points that we can actually compare year on year. And I think that is probably when you are looking at benchmarking, you’re actually looking at similar periods that you can compare, like for like, too and similar content and that kind of thing. So yeah, I hope that answers your question.
Kate Mulqueen
18:02
I’m curious, Kelsey, from an agency perspective, how do creative businesses differ in this space, in terms of what they can do on social media? What’s the kind of difference that you see? Or how would you advise businesses who are starting off or in terms of getting started in this space.
Kelsey Dubar
18:29
So I think, to get to really start off, it’s about doing the self research and just knowing where, what platforms you kind of want to promote your business on and what aligns best with your goals and outcomes of your social media platform. So I know there’s some businesses that thrive really well visually, and so they kind of lean towards that Instagram, have bright colours and graphics and using tone of voice and brand personality to really visualise and enable people to feel and resonate with that brand. Whereas some brands might be better off in terms of Facebook where it’s a bit more talking about the content and the educational pieces behind what you’re needing to share.
So Facebook is good at sharing links and media articles and having that kind of ease of use in a more of a knowledgeable and explanatory kind of way, than Instagram. So Facebook can be really prominent in regards to that kind of area of your work. And then obviously there’s TikTok which is really fun engaging. You want to use tutorials, motion graphics, explainers, really get your face behind the brand. Get other people generating that content and sharing that content too. So yeah, just depending on what your business goals out, you can really focus on those alignments of those different platforms and dive deeper into doing that research and creating mood boards and planning out how you’re going to really develop those platforms to make sure that they project and portray exactly what your business is trying to trying to achieve.
Kate Mulqueen
20:22
Yeah, great. Thanks so much, Kelsey. It’s really interesting to hear that TikTok’s, obviously, a big player now and and as Atong mentioned before, you know, there’s rise of video, but doesn’t necessarily fit every business. And, you know, there’s, I guess that takes us into kind of resourcing. So for a creative business, who’s getting started out? How much time do you think, Kelsey, is kind of reasonable to spend? Let’s say, you know, your business is quite a small business. How should it be kind of prioritised or managed that kind of time input and resourcing input?
Kelsey Dubar
21:02
Yeah, when you’re starting off, it does take a bit more of your time than you probably would suggest it would, just really taking moments to develop that content, and that content creation. So it takes a bit of time for you to learn what your kind of brand colours are, what your tone of voice is, and developing those, as I said before, those mood boards. So you’re probably on there like quite frequently, maybe daily, just touching in on that, because it will build into that personal growth and development of your business as you’re starting off. Because I feel social media needs to come in there in those early days to progress with that business growth, as you’re developing. And Canva’s obviously a really good tool to use for starting off with a business.
It’s got lots of different tools and options in there, for you to get prompts and kind of templates to get going. And it’s kind of a good platform to just learn what you can do and what the abilities are there. Which you can then take away and develop into your own content that is more unique to what you’re looking for. And then it comes into a bigger picture of ‘you’ve got your content’, ‘you’ve got your design’, but then you’re looking into your copywriting. So you’ve got to copyright or your posts and align your tone of voice there and what you’re trying to portray to your audience. So that takes some time to to get all that right and pair that with all your different graphics and content. Then monitoring your channels and making sure that your audience isn’t interacting in a way that you want them to interact. Having that community management there to make sure you can answer questions that come in or respond to anything that maybe isn’t quite favourable on that page, and just trying to work out how that is going to be managed as a whole.
Yeah, and then I guess, those bigger campaigns, they take a lot of time to digest and develop and there’s a lot of time management across those as well. So it’s a ilot of time that does take up. And I think you need to make sure that you factor that in when you are kind of starting up that business and taking that time to put that aside and put the effort into your social media, because it is a really strong driver of success there too.
Kate Mulqueen
23:30
Atong, I just wanted to ask you on from your perspective, how much time do you spent weekly, daily on social media?
Atong Atem
23:40
That’s a great question. Because I do think that it’s quite easy, as an artist, maybe or as like a sole trader or somebody who is like the kind of sole business operator, it is really easy to get caught up in it. Especially because it’s sort of an extension of our lives. I think at the beginning, it was quite intuitive. And, you know, I maybe posted quite a lot because I was excited to share things, you know, because I was sharing things like process photos, I was sharing what I was working on. I was sharing, you know, what I was researching at the time. And a lot of the people, my audience at the time, I suppose were other artists and writers and, you know, people in uni doing their masters or whatever. So there was a lot of space to sort of exchange.
And it felt kind of easy and natural to post probably every day, you know, maybe a couple of times a day. And over time, maybe because I got busier or maybe because I got more intentional, I sort of limited it to, you know, at most one post a day. I think once I became aware of the fact that there is an audience beyond people that I know personally and they’re interacting with this work and interacting with what I post, it sort of made sense to be mindful of how I was engaging with that audience, and what I was sharing, without necessarily editing what I was sharing. And that meant, maybe not not overwhelming the feed with with lots and lots of stuff, being maybe cautious of when I was posting. Like, say if I had an event, an upcoming exhibition or something, and I want people to come and I want them to be aware of the dates and the information, perhaps posting at like two o’clock in the morning isn’t a great idea, because by the time people wake up, the next morning, it will have been at the bottom of the feed, no one’s going to get to it, and no one will know.
So you know, when are people likely to be looking at their phone, and it’s usually while they’re at work. So I’d be posting during the day for really important stuff. And I think now, I definitely engage a lot less with social media, and predominantly only use it to show you know, upcoming events or exhibition openings or whatever. Which means that I’m probably a little bit even more so mindful of when I’m posting because, you know, it’s sort of the attention economy thing, right, where we’re trying to establish how to grab people’s attention, and competing with millions of other things that are grabbing people’s attention. And it is tough to talk about it quite practically, in that way as an artist because you want it to kind of be flowy and sort of natural and authentic.
But I do think that you can be mindful of ways to interact with this tool, while also being authentic to yourself. And that means that if I’m going to post about, say, an upcoming exhibition, I’m going to talk about it as if I were talking to a group of friends about it, but still include the information and post it at a time when people are most likely to look at it. So, yeah, it doesn’t have to be kind of methodical in the, you know, the content, so to speak. But being mindful of that, so to answer your question, I probably post maybe a couple of times a fortnight, because there’s not something on all the time. Yeah
Kate Mulqueen
27:02
And Anna, from the perspective of Rising, I guess, it’s a big organisation, not just a sole trader, you know, sort of sole artist, how do you manage that resourcing or weighing up the kind of cost/benefit of like the time, that the staff time, that it takes to kind of plan, social media and the types of content that might take longer to create versus the outcome or benefit of that content and the purpose or value of it?
Anna Horan
27:32
Yeah, I suppose we are big organisation, but pretty small team for content. So we have someone who, their job is dedicated to running all of our channels, we have quite a few of them. And they’re obviously quite essential to our marketing efforts, and yes, growing our audiences and that kind of thing. And that will expand when we get into like our peak periods, like, we bring on a lot of freelances, to capture content for us. We’ll have a dedicated social person, he’ll be out there capturing and posting content as it’s happening. And I pretty much check in on it still, yeah, at least twice a day. At this point, it’s quite quiet, because we haven’t announced anything yet.
But yeah, we do still have things out in market, like, we just had the art trams EOI, which went out. And so just making sure that we’re monitoring comments and answering any questions and that kind of thing that comes off the back of that. But I suppose from a kind of a long-term strategy kind of planning perspective, I would recommend spending a decent chunk of time really thinking about what your brand strategy is. Because that will, it should inform what your content that you’re posting is going to be.
And that’s really just setting you know, starting off with thinking about four or five values, like looking at your past work, looking at what you want to be talking about, what you want to be promoting and that kind of thing, and really just I think solidifying, OK, these are the key things I want to be talking about. And then thinking about who your audience is, who you want to be reaching if you don’t already, you know already reach those audiences, and what interests them and what resonates with them. And then based on those two things, like actually writing down OK, what are some goals that I can have around my content? It might be that you could have a long-term goal that’s over a number of years of like, building up to 5000 followers or something like that.
But you could also have a much more short-term goal that might only be a few months or up to 12 months, and really thinking about, OK, I want to increase making them smart. So Specific, Measurable, Actionable, Relevant and Timely. So, you know, I want to increase my followers from 1000 to 2000, on Instagram, by 30 November 2024. And I think that those kinds of parameters, like written down, it will become really clear to you like, it will come into focus what kind of content you should be making, what channels you should be focusing on.
If you’re just starting out, you probably only want to do one or two, I can tell you that managing upwards of eight channels is a lot of work, and requires a lot of planning, and a lot of money to make some quality content that goes out on a regular basis. So yeah, I think start small, but really, like, put down on a piece of paper, what your goals are, what your values are, and, yeah, who your audience is. And, yeah, that’s the best advice I can probably give to someone starting out.
Kate Mulqueen
31:08
And Kelsey, I’m curious as well, from your perspective, you know, advising other businesses and working with other businesses about return on investment. You know, like, how do you measure the success of, of social social media? How did how does it translate from followers to actual business? Success?
Kelsey Dubar
31:32
Yeah, so, I guess, the return on investment is something that will need to be kind of closely monitored, but it will take some time, it’s not just going to be an instant result, and you’re not just going to start your social media and just hope that you’re just going to get a whole bunch of followers, a whole bunch of customers come through buying your products. It’s all about the journey, and it’s about learning yourself as well. So just making sure that kind of like what Anna was saying before you kind of sit down those goals, so you’ve got those achievements along your way.
So that revenue stream will start coming in at some point. And whether that’s six months down the track, whether that’s 12 months down the track, it’s all about the progress. So if you’re keeping that content regular, if you’re talking to the right audiences, and really focusing on the content you’re putting out there, and the goals that you’re aiming for, the revenue will start to come as you progress. So I think it’s challenging, and it’s something that you do want an instant gratification of a self-achievement for your social media channels and for your business. But, yeah, it’s putting, even just little things like putting LinkedIn bios and tagging products in your posts and doing paid advertising, all those things they do, they all bulk up, and they work together to to give you that revenue stream.
So yeah, I think till you get time, and just focusing on if you have the money to put behind it, put the money behind it, and focus on those on those paid channels and building that demographic in that regard, because they are going to be your prospective customers and the customers that you might not have had aligned in your initial goals. And then you can build and the stream will become bigger for those campaigns that you that you that you run. Such as, like recently, the Black Friday sales and things like that, you’re just getting ads and ads and ads from people and it’s all about ‘click here to receive 60% off’ or ‘click here to to get a free sample’ with your next purchase. So those those small advertising streams are really vital in driving that revenue too in terms of that kind of paid versus organic content that you’re putting out. And from a metrics kind of point of view, really gathering those metrics and analysing your reports. And month by month, just seeing where the demographics are, where the audience is coming from, what content is performing well, what impressions you’re getting, so that you can really work through all those analytics to strengthen your next campaign or strengthen the next social media content that you’re developing.
So that you can build bigger revenue streams for yourselves and reach larger audiences. And that organic content is always going to sit there and it’s going to be consistent, and it’s going to be always owned content, which is telling a brand story, but to keep driving that and to keep building it and to keep getting that end result that you really want, sometimes it does cost a little bit more than what you intended. And that advertising needs to be really strong and quite powerful and what you’re aiming for. So, yeah, really looking at, not just the organic, but also the paid, and then how you can create bigger campaigns to drive that revenue as well.
Kate Mulqueen
35:24
Anna, from your perspective, how do you see the difference between the paid digital advertising that can be done on Instagram and Facebook and these channels versus the organic posts? How do you see the difference?
Anna Horan
35:38
Yeah, I suppose I like to think about it as brand building versus I suppose sales activation, or the money making part. So, and you need to put money behind both of those things. But primarily organic content, it should be about brand building. So really speaking to those values, I suppose building up the associations you want people to have about who you are and what you’re doing. And then in terms of the paid, that’s really about reaching as many people as possible. But it also depends on where you are in terms of the marketing funnel. So basic marketing funnel is awareness, consideration and conversion. And awareness is kind of the top of the funnel, it’s the mass market, reaching as many people as possible. Consideration is getting people to consider your brand, they know who you are. And they’re kind of weighing up their options.
And then conversion is about actually making the sale or getting them to convert into becoming an email subscriber or something like that. So yeah, in terms of awareness, that’s always going to be brand building. And yeah, your goal there is to reach as many people as possible, so people actually know you exist. And also building up those positive associations you want about how your brand is perceived. And then, yeah, the sales kind of revenue part of it starts to come into play in terms of consideration and conversion. So, yeah, actually putting a product in front of someone and showing them the benefits, the features, the emotional pay-off that they’ll get from, you know, buying your art, or coming to an event and that kind of thing. Yeah, so I guess there is a bit of a trickle down from awareness through to conversion, and you won’t see an awareness ad turn into a sale necessarily, but that’s not what its job is. That part comes later. Yeah.
Kate Mulqueen
37:58
Yeah. Cool. Thanks Anna. And Atong, from your perspective, as an artist, how has social media translated to your success as an artist, selling artwork and making your living as an artist?
AA
Atong Atem
38:13
Yeah, it’s, it’s, um, a multi pronged thing, I would say. I think it can be tricky to sort of translate direct kind of, I don’t know, sales or to be able to really specifically see a tangible translation into, you know, my livelihood. Because the majority of people that are buying my work are not my followers, for the most part, because the work isn’t, you know, a t-shirt or something that sort of… Not everybody wants to buy a, you know, two-metre photograph of my face painted blue. But those who do often will see my work online first, often to the point of, you know, I’ll often get like a call from my gallery, after I’ve posted a work that hasn’t been shown or displayed. I don’t even know what size it’s going to be. And it’s just like, ‘this is something that I’m working on’. And they’ll say ‘somebody’s called or emailed because I want to buy that’. And it’s like, well, it’s not ready.
So it is really similar to what Anna’s saying about that sort of awareness thing. I think the main space that social media occupies for me as an artist, in terms of marketing tool is to create awareness for people to be aware of my existence as an artist and the kind of work that I make, as well as to also advertise, say exhibition openings or talks or, you know, events that people can attend. And then the other part of it also is to kind of, I think, for me, anyway, it’s been a really great space to see what is happening that I can have access to, you know, because I can’t open the Guardian app and know that there’s a residency or whatever. So, being part of an arts community, and also, I think the third and kind of the most tangible thing, in my experience, has been having other larger platforms, say Rising, for example, talk about what I’ve done with them on their social media channels, which then kind of does the trickle down. It’s the only place that trickle down economics is really visible. Because they’ll, you know, follow me.
And now they’ve got an awareness of me as an artist and what I do. So, yeah, it can kind of be discouraging, because there’s sort of that push for more and more followers. But what does that translate to? And I will say that, for me, as an artist, that a lot of people who maybe started following me 5, 10 years ago, those sort of relationships, or those channels have only really eventuated recently, whether it be major institutions that saw me because something, you know, somewhere, I posted something or someone shared something of mine. And you know, there’s an emerging young artist who lives all the way over in Melbourne or whatever.
We’re paying attention to her. Let’s see where she goes. And then years later, it’s like, OK, great. I mean, this incredible group show in a major institution, because they’ve been able to follow my career trajectory. So in that way, it’s like it’s really intangible. But I do think it’s extremely important, especially now, and especially with an extremely global art market. It’s not sort of enough, I guess, to just be local, unless that’s what you want. And the only way really to reach those interstate and international audiences and to show your presence is to be on social media. Yeah, I don’t want to ramble too much, but I think that answers your question.
Kate Mulqueen
41:48
Right, so I’m going to open it up to questions. I’ve got one of the questions here has talked about tools, and kind of what kind of tools to use for planning. But I guess as a broader question, you know, they’ve mentioned Loomly, Hootsuite or Planable, for scheduling. But are there other tools that each of you would recommend that are free potentially to help with video editing, or photo editing or planning or anything like that? I’ll start with you, Atong, because you’re on my screen.
Atong Atem
42:21
So the different tools that you might use? Yeah, I think there’s a lot of advantage to using tools like Hootsuite, for example, which is one that I’ve used in the past. Lots and lots of advantages, especially if you are the business as an individual, or have a small team or a limited budget, it can be really, really great to have one day a week per se, as opposed to every single day of the week where you sit down, and you open up Hootsuite and you schedule all your posts for the week. I think, yeah, it was really useful when I was really, really engaging. And I will say that the reason that maybe I can be less active on social media now is because I spent so much time cultivating a following and creating sort of an awareness. Yeah, I put in the hard yards, and now I can sort of rest a little bit.
Yeah, I think those tools are really, really useful. And I think they’re really necessary at the beginning, if you have a lot of other priorities. That being said, it can also be really fun, if you enjoy it, to be spontaneous. And to make like a story as an artist specifically of, say, like, ‘I’m in the studio right now and this, excuse me, this interesting thing came out of this, you know, experimentation that I’m doing’. And I do think audiences really, really, really love seeing what I’m doing outside of just telling them where to go to see my work. Audiences love when I’m, I don’t know, I don’t know going on a walk or whatever. And I might ‘this is a photo of me in the garden’, because it feels like they’re, they’re not following (coughs) excuse me, they’re not following a product. They’re not engaging with like a abstract concept. They’re following an artist and her journey as she grows.
And as she kind of establishes herself and as her work grows and changes, so for artists who are sort of the product, you as a person can kind of feel like a product, I do think even if you use the tools, it’s really important to make it real, as real as possible. So that one, you don’t lose yourself in the realm and two, so that you kind of have a kind of solid relationship with what you’re doing and what you’re using social media for. So yes to the tools, but don’t let it get draggy and boring.
Kate Mulqueen
44:44
Fair enough. Kelsey, you mentioned Canva before. Are there any other tools that you would recommend people use particularly free tools?
Kelsey Dubar
44:53
Um, there’s a few scheduling platforms out there that you know, good to like kick start just to kind of get your planning in place, so you can schedule in your posts and your copy and your hashtags and kind of do that all in advance, so that you can do it in a week, two weeks in advance, a month in advance. So that kind of kind of helps you settle, so you don’t have to be on it every single day. And, you know, it’s just going to roll out with ease. So there are a few scheduling platforms out there that are free, and free to use. And I do know that HubSpot do have a few social media templates and scheduling templates that you can download, and copy across to use yourself, which I found very beneficial – kind of calendar layouts. And you can get key social dates for each month, like if it’s, World Bring Your Dog Day to Work or something like that.
So you can be like, ‘Oh, that’s a fun day, maybe I’ll do all those fun social posts on that.’ Things like that. So yeah, there’s a quite a few scheduling ones out there. And I would also recommend Canva, like I mentioned before, because it’s just a whole world of creativity in Canva. And with social media, you can edit photos, you can use different tags, you can use different colourways, you can crop things… they’ve got AI tools in there now that you can use as well. Animations, GIFs, you can do all sorts of stuff in there. So it’s a really good hub to express your creativity. And to really get started in that space. As you develop your brand and your social tools.
Kate Mulqueen
46:35
And Anna I’m curious from your perspective, any tools that you would recommend, free tools that people can use?
Anna Horan
46:42
Um, yeah, I suppose Vimeo is also is a free video editing software. Canva also has video editing now I’ve seen. I would also honestly say that your phone is a really powerful device and the photography it’s capable of, and the editing software that’s already built in, is incredible. So yeah, I think just looking up some basics in photography in terms of, like, how to frame a photo, rule of thirds, and then actually looking into ‘what does exposure mean?’ ‘What is contrast’, all of those things. You can take some really beautiful photography, and edit it directly on your phone. And that applies to video as well. And then I think Tiktok and Instagram also have some really incredible editing tools built into the apps themselves. And they also have lots of templates that you can play with.
I think you can get a little bit carried away or overwhelmed by the idea of filters and effects and that kind of thing. But if you’re just sticking to the video part of it, it can be really simple to get the hang of. And I think if you’re a little afraid to do it on your kind of public-facing accounts, you can always start like just kind of a burner test account that’s private, that no one can see, just to kind of play around with some of those features and see how they publish to a feed. Because I think that is really the best advice. And, you know, I’ve talked to lots of people at TikTok and that kind of thing about how do you make exciting, engaging content and that kind of thing. And their number one piece of advice is to just try things and get it out there and see what your community on there actually responds to.
Because there is also I think, you know, you don’t have to be super polished these days. It used to feel like you had to really bring your A game and like have the most stylised shoot. But we’re actually seeing because of the rise of TikTok like that kind of authentic shot on the fly, kind of behind the scenes content really resonating with people because it feels so real. So yeah.
Kate Mulqueen
49:04
It’s really good advice. It’s really good advice. Now, Atong has to leave in a couple of minutes. So I just wanted to direct a question that comes from the audience to you. It’s from this gentleman says, ‘I’m an artist. My main social media account is Instagram. Should I be using a creative account? What are the advantages’? I’m not sure if you use a creative account at all, or what your view is?
Atong Atem
49:27
I did use a creative account for a while. I think the only advantage at the time was that it allowed like Linkln bio before that was available to to more people. But I don’t think it’s necessary. I actually think speaking as someone who engages and follows other artists and businesses and so on, the things that I kind of pay attention to is, I do notice that if I see what looks like a business kind of structure on an artist or an individual’s kind of social media page I assume maybe that it’s less personal or something, which can sometimes be a drawback. Sometimes that’s a great advantage, especially if you’re, say, a photographer, and you’re advertising your service as a photographer.
But, as a visual artist, I think that we are lucky that we have the freedom to be able to sort of dictate the rules for engagement with our work, and then how we share it. So yeah, I don’t I don’t think it’s necessary. And I don’t think that the advantages that it offers are really that awesome. Like, it’s the ability to maybe see more metrics, which the metrics that you get to see already on Instagram just for having an account are really, really useful. But I would suggest trying it and seeing if it feels better. I think, to kind of go off what you had said, Anna, about having like a burner account, I think that is really, really useful. And I didn’t necessarily have a burner account, I just kind of had no followers for ages.
So that gave me the freedom to play around with different formats, to see what looked good on my page, and what didn’t to see if I needed to be like really, like structured or if I needed to break it up with personal things. And, yeah, I think, trialling things and seeing what works for you, but also what you think looks good is a really, really good idea.
Kate Mulqueen
51:21
And I’ll let you go Atong. Because I know you have to go. And thanks so much. Now, this question has come from another person, I might direct this to Kelsey, ‘I have different identities: artist and publisher and have two Instagram accounts and one Facebook. But there’s overlap, which I try to manage. It feels difficult to do that now as well, some followers of the same I feel I’m reaching a different audience with each of them. Would it be better to just have one account?’
Kelsey Dubar
51:51
There are still benefits of having two: Facebook and Instagram. They do differ in terms of your followers, but also in terms of your advertising streams as well. So if you are going down that kind of paid advertising route, those targeted audiences that you can build on both Facebook and Instagram, you can divert them, and you can make them quite different. And the same with your content. When you post on Instagram compared to Facebook, you can divide that content up and make it quite unique to each platform. If it’s becoming that you’re feeling like your followers are the same, that’s not a problem. And if your content’s the same, I don’t think that’s a problem, either.
You’re still putting that content out there, and you’re still getting that outreach, double the amount than you are if you just had that single platform. So it’s not taking up any more of your time or energy to create the content for both platforms, I’d definitely keep them both there, because they’re both still very valid. And they’re both still quite highly valued platforms for social media.
A lot of people are saying Facebook is a lot quieter, and it is quietening down. And it’s not as prominent as, say Instagram, but there’s still a lot of people on there. And there’s still a lot of people that use Instagram versus Facebook. So your audiences will be slightly different still on both those platforms. So I would recommend keeping them both, just keep that content the same, if that’s going to make it easier for you.
Kate Mulqueen
53:18
And there’s a question about Threads. Anna and you mentioned Threads before. This person said what is the best thing about usingThreads? Who do you reach that’s different from Instagram?
Anna Horan
53:28
Yeah, I suppose. One of the reasons why we still have our Twitter though we’re slowly – I refuse to call it X – moving away from it, is the fact that there are a lot of I suppose arts journalists, and people within the sector there. There are still conversations that are happening. And, yeah, I think the thing about Threads is that well, I think a lot of people are like, what’s the point? It’s like nothing special. It’s exactly Twitter or whatever. I think that’s probably why it’s going to eventually take off, is the fact that people will just flee from from Xand be able to have the exact same experience that they had on that platform onto Threads.
So while I think it’s like taking a little while to take off, the fact that people could instantly gather 1000s of followers because of the crossover with Instagram. Yeah, I think people will go there for different content, than Instagram. I think it will become the place where yeah, much like Twitter was back in its heyday, a conversation and discussion platform.
Kate Mulqueen
54:40
This is a very… we’ve only got one minute left to answer a very big question, but one has come through about to any of the panellists have an opinion on using AI led content for social media for brand business, and this person feels unsure about this space. Do you have any thoughts on this, Anna?
Anna Horan
54:58
Yes. Um, yeah, I think from an art making perspective and putting original artwork into AI, that is ethically, not even ambiguous, I think it’s kind of wrong. But in terms of marketing, and that kind of thing, it is a really useful tool, and I have personally used it. In copywriting, it can be a really great starting point, like dumping a whole bunch of thoughts or condensing a, you know, 2000 words into a 200-word post, it can be really powerful in that sense of something that would have taken you two or three hours to do, and think about and really kind of drain your brain on it can do in literally under a second. So yeah, in that sense, I think it can be useful for non art making. And I think you’ll be seeing it more and more.
Kate Mulqueen
56:00
Yeah. And I might just ask you both quickly, for your top tip to close on. Maybe I’ll throw to you, Kelsey, first.
Kelsey Dubar
56:11
I think with social media, it’s all about just letting your creativity flow, just let open up, just let it flow out. Just get those ideas out, get those mood board concepts out. Speak true to you, what you want to stay out there. Just trust yourself. And don’t be shy and really express what you want to see in your brand or your business. And, yeah, just go out there and do it. I think a lot of people do get a bit worried. And there’s a lot of umming and ahhing and trying to hide behind a brand or hide behind a surface. But there is a lot of authenticity out there now. And people want to be able to relate to your brand. So I think, yeah, just go out there and do it. Do what you want to do. Be creative, get those colours out there and enjoy it. It’s a really fun journey and a fun pathway to grow.
Anna Horan
56:59
Yeah, I’d semi cheated and saw that someone asked a question about burnout and social media, which having worked in this space for a really long time, yeah, it resonates with me and needing to turn off and disengage from it all. I probably don’t have specific tips and tricks for that. But I did recently watch a great, essentially a TED talk. But it was for the Adobe Creative Conference. I’ve forgotten what it’s actually called. But there’s a creator called Karen X Cheng. And her whole talk is about, yes, staying true to yourself as an artist, building your following, but then also taking care of yourself. And, yeah, so I highly recommend watching that.
Kate Mulqueen
57:47
Thank you both. I’ll turn to Claire, I think it is to to follow up with the closing remarks. Thank you.
MS
Madeleine Swain
58:00
Hi, no it’s actually me, Madeleine Swain. Hi, everybody. Thank you, Kate. I’m Madeleine. I’m the managing editor at ArtsHub. We’re coming to the end of our time now. So on behalf of the teams at ArtsHub and Creative Victoria, I’d like to thank everyone for joining us. And I’d like to ask you to join me in thanking our panel, Anna, Kelsey, and Atong who are already gone. And thank you again, Kate. And thank you everybody for your questions. I’d just like to note that there were quite a few coming in at the end about how to handle negative feedback and trolling.
And that’s such a huge topic that we really don’t have time to cover it today. But we will be putting some resources into the follow-up article after this webinar. So look out for that. And if you haven’t done yet, don’t forget that you can catch up on the four previous webinars via artshub.com.au Or at Creative Vic’s website and you can check them down on YouTube too. And this one will be available to view shortly. And as Claire mentioned at the beginning, we’ve also now launched our associated podcast series and you can see Episode One and the first part of Episode Two. Listen to them. Sorry, available now to listen to on Spotify and Apple podcasts.
And to find out about any upcoming events in the Creative Exchange series., please subscribe to the Creative Victoria e-newsletter or follow the organisation on social media. And do remember to use those hashtags I think they were put into the chat earlier the #CreativeVic and the #CreativeXchange ones. And please do complete the feedback survey, which helps us with our next webinars. Thanks again to everybody for joining us today and we’ll see you all next time.
Watch the previous webinars and listen to the new related podcasts in the Creative Exchange series.
